The Purge

PvP for People Who Aren't Asshats
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 4:54 pm 
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Ability to see players names
I think DAOC did this. You identified people based on their reputation and appearance. At best, you should be seeing guild crests/rings/capes/icons like Aion has. the ability to loot these when you kill would put subversion tactics into the game. Just like Aion/champions does, you should be able to determine what you look like, for little or no cost. So maybe your entire guild has a custom armor look and colors. You should not be able to change in the field however, or it should take some time.

Ability to see enemy players class
Just because someone is carrying a sword does not make them a swordmaster. You wouldnt know til it was too late. Which is why combat should be take more time. This would be very easy to accomplish with a classless skill based game.

Any sort of radar
I suppose Aion did this, since hackers would have done it anyhow...so equalize everyone

Ability to stay stealthed and moving for infinite time and in broaddaylight
I think moving while stealthed should have a chance to break your stealth, just like D&D. The more mobs and players are in the area the more chance of it happening. However I like the ability to 'camo' up near natural landmarks/nature. WHere you can stay for extended periods without being seen. Just picture the snipers in vietnam, they could hide in a bush and remain motionless while enemy troops ran by within feet. Unless someone with tracking skills is actively looking for you, you should be able to camo.

Games have caught up with terrian that helps play into fights, however they have not mastered ecosystems, seasons or day/nite functions. You need shadows or camo in order to stealth. Camo colored armor would work well in certain zones and make you stand out in others.


Feel free to debate or add items. I'm sick of the generic fantasy mmo that takes no chances and just keeps up the WoW clone standard.

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Last edited by Diggles on Thu Nov 05, 2009 5:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 5:06 pm 
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Diggles wrote:
Ability to see players names

You mean at all, or the floaty names? I wouldn't mind disabling floaty names but I like knowing who I just killed, or who just killed me, because it makes it more personal.

Plus, if it's a guild war (factional) type game you need to see player names since anyone could become an ally later.

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Ability to see enemy players class

I dunno... I'm thinking of like TF2. If someone could look like a Heavy but was actually a Medic or a Scout, what does that add to the gameplay? I think it might just make the game more frustrating. I like to know something about who I'm about to try and kill.

I do like skill based classless systems, though, in which case this problem goes away anyway. Ideally we could hide behind a tree and watch to get an idea of what our intended victim was doing.

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Any sort of radar

Yeah, I dunno about this one. EQ didn't have radar, but every dipshit cheater in the game had ShowEQ anyway. Ideally line of sight could be enforced server-side rather than client-side, which would totally solve this problem but if that's not doable then we might need radar just to keep things even.

I do miss being able to sneak up on people in the water or by hiding behind trees, though. Server-side LOS enforcement should be a priority item, to be implemented if at all possible. (By this I mean that if the server decides that you can't see me, then it simply doesn't send the packet telling you where I'm at.)

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Ability to stay stealthed and moving for infinite time and in broaddaylight

Yeah, stealth should be a limited and more complex mechanic. Aion at least took a nod in this direction by making stealth very limited (duration-wise), but even there, if someone stealths in front of you, you can't do anything about it until it wears off. There should be some "I know you're there" facility to de-stealth someone if you know where they are, like a ground targetable AE de-cloak bomb.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 5:10 pm 
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Slamz wrote:
Diggles wrote:
Ability to see players names

You mean at all, or the floaty names? I wouldn't mind disabling floaty names but I like knowing who I just killed, or who just killed me, because it makes it more personal.

Plus, if it's a guild war (factional) type game you need to see player names since anyone could become an ally later.

Quote:
Ability to see enemy players class

I dunno... I'm thinking of like TF2. If someone could look like a Heavy but was actually a Medic or a Scout, what does that add to the gameplay? I think it might just make the game more frustrating. I like to know something about who I'm about to try and kill.

Something within reason. Ie...if you are wearing chain/plate, the colors have to appear metallic, cloth = matte, etc.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2009 5:14 pm 
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couple more

Static transportation 'port in' areas
Eve and Aion fail miserably in this department. Having static spots where a 'gatecamp' can take place is just retarded in a pvp game. Yes of course there should be natural areas that you can control, but 1 static point of entry is fail for a pvp game. Give me multiple ways to get in or attack, some easier/harder or shorter/longer than others

Instantenous Travel aka Hotdrop
Eve Failed in this department with the ability to instantly drop a fleet right on top of you. There should be ample warning before a large number of enemies can appear. THere should be some indication that enemies are inbound to your location, either your own internal sensors or external entity (warp field, teleport rift, etc)

Instagibbing NPC Guards/Towers/Areas
One of the best things about EQ was you almost always had a chance of escape if you got lucky or played your skills right. You respected the guards still because if someone stunned/rooted/snared you, then you were in deep shit...but not 100% certain of death. You should not be safe anywhere to go AFK.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 3:42 pm 
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Diggles wrote:

Static transportation 'port in' areas

Instantenous Travel aka Hotdrop



Most of your things I don't care one way or another but these two above I do agree should never be part of an MMO.

To me they would go on there along with:

No player at anytime should be unable to play his avatar: Fears, Stuns and mezzes have no place in a PVP game. (Please don't confuse interupts with stuns etc)

No speed enhancements: All players should at all times run at the same speeds. SoW's and Snares have no place in a PVP game.

All player skills must be PVP active: If you have skills that are built specifically for PVE and not usuable in PVP for example taunt, block etc then your game is broken before it even gets out of the gate.

PVP with out a strategic component is useless: If there is no reason to pvp then the pvp will be dull. We are past the point of pvping just because we can.

Simple is always better: If you can't have 200 people in the same area pvping with out the game completely collapsing then your game sucks.



Vllad


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 6:14 pm 
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Vllad wrote:
Most of your things I don't care one way or another but these two above I do agree should never be part of an MMO.

To me they would go on there along with:

No player at anytime should be unable to play his avatar: Fears, Stuns and mezzes have no place in a PVP game. (Please don't confuse interupts with stuns etc)

No speed enhancements: All players should at all times run at the same speeds. SoW's and Snares have no place in a PVP game.

Vllad


This is the NO list Vllad, of stuff that SHOULDNT be in the game.

I will disagree about speed enchancements. Yes I think classes, buffs and items that grant speed from thin air are definately a no. But the amount of shit you are carrying should determine your speed.

Have you played Day of Defeat or any of the FPS that let you use stamina to sprint? Sure I can beat you in a 100m race if I use my entire stamina pool, but the lower your stamina the longer it takes to regen. So someone using small bursts will outdistance me in the long run.

Most games that use stamina over due and/or dilute it...letting you sprint for 30+ seconds. Day of Defeat limits you to about 10 seconds max, and it takes 30+ seconds to get it all back blowing that much. The normal is quick sprints from cover to cover, from 1-5 seconds

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2009 7:14 pm 
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Diggles wrote:
This is the NO list Vllad, of stuff that SHOULDNT be in the game.



I understand it is the "No" list, that is why my sentences started with the word no.

There are better ways to restrict bag space with out reducing movement. I don't think you should ever goof around with movement if you want a decent pvp game. AOC had that burst run speed and it was totally abusive and never worked.


Vllad


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 07, 2009 1:34 am 
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Vllad wrote:
Diggles wrote:
This is the NO list Vllad, of stuff that SHOULDNT be in the game.



I understand it is the "No" list, that is why my sentences started with the word no.

There are better ways to restrict bag space with out reducing movement. I don't think you should ever goof around with movement if you want a decent pvp game. AOC had that burst run speed and it was totally abusive and never worked.


Vllad



Its not to restrict bag space, its to benefit people for traveling light, compared to the guys who bring everything and the kitchen sink (pots, scrolls, 2nd suits of armor, etc etc etc)

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 11:54 am 
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Diggles wrote:
Vllad wrote:
Diggles wrote:
This is the NO list Vllad, of stuff that SHOULDNT be in the game.



I understand it is the "No" list, that is why my sentences started with the word no.

There are better ways to restrict bag space with out reducing movement. I don't think you should ever goof around with movement if you want a decent pvp game. AOC had that burst run speed and it was totally abusive and never worked.


Vllad



Its not to restrict bag space, its to benefit people for traveling light, compared to the guys who bring everything and the kitchen sink (pots, scrolls, 2nd suits of armor, etc etc etc)


Exactly, who really needs a kitchen sink?... But what happened to just Rations and potions.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:18 pm 
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Running back to town to swap out your gear deposit stuff you didnt want to get jacked was not fun in UO. Realism doesn't trump entertainment.

Big bags or low necessary inventory to function. If you make a quest game FFS dont make quest items take up bag space, one of the few things War did well.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 10:05 pm 
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Jakensama wrote:
Running back to town to swap out your gear deposit stuff you didnt want to get jacked was not fun in UO. Realism doesn't trump entertainment.

Big bags or low necessary inventory to function. If you make a quest game FFS dont make quest items take up bag space, one of the few things War did well.


Wow you must have been a complete noob if you had to run back to town. I suppose you don't remember the runes so you could teleport to the bank drop off your stuff and then teleport back to the dungeon?

I liked the fact that you could lose all your gear in UO. It meant that people weren't running around with epic gear. Most everyone just had Grand-Master crafted items which helped to keep the player economy going. Also all items lost some durability when they were repaired so you couldn't just keep using the same weapon forever. Which was fine so long as you were just using the Grand Master items.

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