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 Post subject: Cases
PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 3:39 pm 
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Got any case recommendations?

The bigger the better. I particularly want one that's got plenty of front-to-back room so that it's not so hard dealing with the drive bays jammed up against the video card, or dealing with my motherboard which for some damn reason has the SATA ports sideways rather than facing straight out where normal human beings can access them. I'm tempted to just hang my components on a wall and blow a fan at them but I suppose a really big case would be more aesthetically pleasing.


Black Friday comin' up so I'm thinking about some upgrades.

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 4:11 pm 
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I will send you a name when I get home. I got a huge case with two 8" fans that I have been a huge fan of.

The low temperatures I run with the bigger case and multiple fans has really lowered the wear and tear on my machine. Especially living in a cold weather city where their are far more extreme temperatures in the house.

I was turning over machines about every 18 to 20 months since I moved to Buffalo until I went with a big case.


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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 4:43 pm 
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IN WIN D-frame :)

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 5:36 pm 
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Thermaltake 10 GT. It is around $300 and worth every penny. It is a full tower case but it comes with a handle if you have to move it.

I will never not have another full tower case again after the money I have spent on everything other than full tower.


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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 5:37 pm 
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Corsair Obsidian 800D is what I'm currently using. It's a beast, it's great for airflow, for clean cabling, for a large mobo and tons of components, for a big air cooler or complex water cooling, lots of bay doors. Very easy to work in when building your own machine. Would definitely recommend it (or whatever the latest incarnation is of the 800D - I built mine a few years ago).

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 1:20 pm 
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I have a Lian Li case that has worked well for me, although I have it more for the number of drive bays than for the airflow (which is still good, due to the 6 120mm fans). that one doesn't appear to be made any more, but I found a couple other big cases:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112311
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112312

both of those appear very similar except that the more expensive one has a black painted interior instead of shiny bare metal.

this Corsair case looks like it has plenty of room front-to-back but it only comes with 3 fans rather than 6. on the plus side, it's less than half the price of the big Lian-Li cases. it's also available in white and black if you don't like military green.

the Magnum TX10 is big too, but probably bigger than you need unless you're building a highly-redundant system with two motherboards.

if you do decide to just have everything out in the open with a fan blowing, you have options there too.

-ken

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 2:39 pm 
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not sure why you guys are looking at hundred+ dollar cases. Unless you are overclocking and/or running watercooling, a case is a case is a case. You plan on modding your case to add neon/LED lights or something?

Any full-tower sized or server sized case is going to do pretty much the exact same job as something that costs x3 as much.
Use the filter to find the options you want. Newegg is great at showing you the inside so you know whether or not its going to fit.

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 3:12 pm 
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My current case is a pile of crap, though. It's a full tower but not very well laid out. And the fans it came with were poorly made. Had to replace 2 of the 3 (they would start to wobble and knock around; one eventually quit -- not apparently dusty, just bad quality). NZXT brand.

The Thermaltake 10 GT looks pretty good. The $300 one include a liquid cooling system but Amazon reviewers pretty well thoroughly denounce it. I'll probably go with the regular one which has high reviews. I like that the door can just be swung open.

Gonna keep an eye out on black friday deals and see if any of the above suggestions appear. That and an upgraded video card.

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 3:27 pm 
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Diggles wrote:
not sure why you guys are looking at hundred+ dollar cases.
FWIW, I was joking with my recommendation, and I agree, it's pretty silly to spend more than maybe $150 on a case(and even that is high for me).

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2013 3:01 am 
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Diggles wrote:
not sure why you guys are looking at hundred+ dollar cases. Unless you are overclocking and/or running watercooling, a case is a case is a case. You plan on modding your case to add neon/LED lights or something?

Any full-tower sized or server sized case is going to do pretty much the exact same job as something that costs x3 as much.
Use the filter to find the options you want. Newegg is great at showing you the inside so you know whether or not its going to fit.



Yeah, I do overclock when I build my rigs, along with SLI cards, many HDs, tons of fans and liquid cooling.

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 10:29 am 
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Diggles wrote:
not sure why you guys are looking at hundred+ dollar cases.


If you get a quality case you will save the extra money you spend. Heat dispersion is the key to a computers long life. Bad designs or a lack of cooling capability will just cause you to spend more in the long run. Fan quality and sound is also important. You can have a shit load of fans but if you can't hear over them it doesn't do any good either. The case diversity will also allow you to upgrade for a much longer period of time.

Buy a cheap case and you will own a cheap machine.


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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 1:18 pm 
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Your argument is basically worthless as there is no SPECIFICATION listed on cases that measures or approximates airflow. Sorry but COST != performance. Using your logic I should also buy the $100 MONSTER GOLD HDMI cables too, right?
Fans are cheap, 5-15 dollars and they wear out and need regular replacement for any hardcore computer user. Basing your case decision off what fans come with a case is like buying a Car for the tires they have.

Sorry but an expensive case likely isnt going to do anything better than 'well-designed' average cost one. Look at the images and layout on Newegg and make an informed decision, not based on dollar amount.

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 3:40 pm 
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Diggles wrote:
Your argument is basically worthless as there is no SPECIFICATION listed on cases that measures or approximates airflow.


Yes there is. You need to do more homework.

Diggles wrote:
Sorry but COST != performance. Using your logic I should also buy the $100 MONSTER GOLD HDMI cables too, right?


I never said cost = performance. You should re-read my post.


Diggles wrote:

Fans are cheap, 5-15 dollars and they wear out and need regular replacement for any hardcore computer user. Basing your case decision off what fans come with a case is like buying a Car for the tires they have.



Good fans don't wear out. If you are a hardcore computer user you should be buying fans that you never have to replace. Which was my point to begin with. If you buy a quality case you save money in the long run.

Your car analogy would only be applicable if the tires it comes with never wear out and you never have to replace them.

Now if you can only purchase the no wear tire with certain model's of cars then your analogy would be correct.

Diggles wrote:
Sorry but an expensive case likely isnt going to do anything better than 'well-designed' average cost one.


I don't disagree in general. Our views of average cost are obviously not the same if you think $300 is expensive.

Diggles wrote:
Look at the images and layout on Newegg and make an informed decision, not based on dollar amount.


I don't recall ever saying you should make your decision based on a dollar amount. I believe I clearly listed some things you should consider when picking out a case none of which discussed cost.

Since you feel so strongly that buying $300 cases is a waste of money I assume you have bought them in the past and was unsatisfied? Please list the ones you have used.


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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 3:52 pm 
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the tire analogy would be appropriate if you were, for example, choosing between trucks with 4 tires, 6 tires or 10 tires. but keep in mind it's not the tires themselves that are important, rather it's the fact that the truck is designed to use that many.

if you need a 6-tire truck, your best bet is to buy a 6-tire truck, rather than buying a 4-tire truck and trying to figure out how to add 2 more. but there's nothing wrong with buying a 6-tire truck with cheap tires (assuming the rest of the truck is well built) and replacing them with better tires afterwards.

-ken

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 6:32 pm 
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If you buy a car that comes with shitty tires, you can replace the tires.

If you buy a car that's poorly designed, has the instrument panel under the seat, requires you to remove the passenger side airbag to check the fuse box and makes you remove the hood every time you want to check the oil (and getting the hood back on is a pain in the ass) THEN it's a lot like buying a bad case.


Things I do not like about my NZXT case:
* Drive bays are too close to the spot where the video cards go in. There's literally no room between my nVidia 480 and the drive bays.
* The side panel doesn't slide off easily or go back on easily
* The side panel fan wire is connected to the regular wires so I have to disconnect the fan to really get the door out of the way.
* It wants you to load drives so that the plugs face to the back-panel. The back-panel comes off but there's so little room between it and the drives that you can end up knocking the drive plugs out trying to get the panel back on.
* The front-side USB plugs are on the bottom left of the case which might be cool if the tower was on my desk but being on the floor I'd rather have more top plugs.

Basically, I agree that $300+ does not necessarily equal "awesome case".

But you are wrong if you think all cases are the same and any ol' random case is sufficient.

I also conceptually agree with Vllad's statement that a case with more/better fans for better airflow should lead to longer component life. And cases that include small fans end up sounding like jet engines because the small fans have to turn so much faster to move the same amount of air.

I got my parents an Antex P280 case for like $110. That was "sufficient". Better than mine but still not my first choice. IIRC, it avoided the side-fan wire problem by just not having one.

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 1:47 pm 
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If you've never replaced a fan, you arent running your computer hard enough. I use mine on average 6-8 hours a day. I've probably replaced 15+ fans over 10 years. Same $75 Case has seen 3-4 motherboards upgrades thru the years.
Fans use bearings, bearings wear out...just like Tires, just like harddrives...they're mechanical devices with a finite amount of run time. I've purchased multiple brands, multiple types, all wear out eventually. Even some of the fluid bearing ones that cost X3 as much (or more) only say they last 50% longer.

So what type of bearings do your fans that you've never replaced use?

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 3:08 pm 
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Diggles wrote:
So what type of bearings do your fans that you've never replaced use?



That is a good question. I really have no idea and will have to research that.


I have a full tower case that have had the same two 8" fans on the right side of the case for almost 4 years. This is quiet common on Themalakes and Corsairs from what I have read. I use my computer about 7 to 10 hours a day.

My fans also have thermal sensors that turn them on and off depending on the temperture. If the case is well designed to deflect heat and keep plenty of room between hardware, fans don't even need to run all of the time assuming you live in a place that is below 71 degree's consistantly. (I pulled that number off of the Therma web site that recommends that temp)

From what I have read larger fans not only are much more quiet but in general they last longer because they don't have to do as many revolutions to accomplish the
same job.

It is probably a combination of all of the factors not just fan quality. Good case design, well controlled heat dispersion, the right kind of hardware spacing and larger fans probably all add up to long lasting fans.


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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 8:21 pm 
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most of my machines are on all the time and the only case fans I have had to replace are the crappy ones that came with cheap cases (mostly 80mm fans).

my current firewall/router is an old Dell Optiplex GX1 (400MHz Pentium II) which is still using the original fan (although it's now on its second power supply). I don't recall exactly how old it is, but I'm pretty sure it's more than 10 years.

I have a couple of Compaq Proliant servers (a Proliant 1500R and a Proliant 6500R, iirc.) I'm not using them now but I ran them for years and never had to replace a fan (although I had to replace a lot of the drives).

my current server has a Tyan motherboard in a Lian Li case (the one with 6 fans that I mentioned). None of the fans in that system have failed yet and that machine is usually running 24x7. the motherboard is the one from the AMD/Microsoft road show (it came with 2 Opteron CPUs and a copy of Windows Server 2003 Enterprise) and I've been using it for a long time, maybe 8+ years.

I've had a bunch of non-case fans fail: a couple of CPU fans, a couple of northbridge fans, and the factory fan on an old ATI-branded Radeon.

-ken

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Naval Action: Taralin Snow, Snowy Iggles
EQ2: Snowreap, Yellowtail, Taralin, Disruption, Preyz, Taralynne, Snowy, Snowz
ESO: Snowreap, Yellowtail
PS2: Snowreap
GW2: Snowreap, Yellowtail, Preyz, Taralin, Taralynne
RIFT: Snowreap, Yellowtail, Preyz, Taralin, Snowy
PotBS (British): Taralin Snow, Taralynne Snow, Snowy Iggles, Edward Snow
PotBS (Pirate): Taralin Snowden, Taralynne Snowden, Redshirt Snowden
WW2O: Snowreap
WAR: Snowreap, Preyz, Lbz, Leadz, Snowz, Taralin, Snowmeltz, Yellowtail, Snowbankz
APB: Snowreap, Sentenza
STO: Snowreap@Snowreap, Snowz@Snowreap
AoC: Yellowtail, Snowreap, Snowstorm, Redshirt
WoW (Horde): Snowreap, Savagery, Baelzenun, Wickedwendy, Taralin, Disruption, Scrouge, Bette
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AC1: Snowstorm, Yellowtail, Shirt Ninja, Redshirt


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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2013 11:13 am 
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Yes fan bearings will eventually wear out but, if you have a good quality fan, it probably isn't going to happen before you replace it anyway for other reasons. For example, to add to Snowreap's examples, I had a server where I work now that ran 24 hours a day/7 days a week/365 days a year for almost 10 years that not only didn't have any case fan failures, it had no component failures at all and is only out of service now because we upgraded the system that was running on it and it no longer met system requirements. That server was part of a 2 server pair. Its partner had a motherboard go out during that same time frame but none of its fans or other components failed.

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2013 6:56 pm 
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In this thread, Diggles learns that he's been using terrible fans, all this time.

I've actually never had fans go bad before I used this case. The fans I used as replacements actually came from an older case.

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2013 7:43 pm 
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I almost always buy the newegg top picks/bestbuys & with highest ratings

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 2:36 pm 
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Diggles wrote:
I almost always buy the newegg top picks/bestbuys & with highest ratings


that's taking advice from the proletariat.


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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Fri Nov 22, 2013 4:23 pm 
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Breand wrote:
Diggles wrote:
I almost always buy the newegg top picks/bestbuys & with highest ratings


that's taking advice from the proletariat.

Agreed... I usually find studies done on them(like toms hardware) and use that to make my decisions. I'm currently running 2 cougar vortex fans which were great and quiet for their cost.

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Sun Dec 22, 2013 2:35 pm 
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I got Vllad's case and it's great. Tons of room. I compared the case dimensions to other common full size cases and this was the largest in all directions. Ample room behind an nVidia 780 video card and I can actually plug in those stupid sideways SATA cables on the Asus motherboard.

I just added this liquid cooler to the CPU:
http://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Series-Ex ... B009ZN2NH6

That greatly increased the noise (2 smaller fans replacing the huge top case fan) but man, what a difference that thing makes. I always thought liquid cooling was a bit of a gimmick but no. Previously I was hitting over 90 degrees C on my CPU if I was really blasting it with something (mostly when doing video processing, which uses every core at nearly 100% for 10-20 minutes).

Now I've overclocked it to Ludicrous Speed and it still stays under 75C at full blast. ~40 degrees for normal usage, which is cooler than I was idling with the default Intel heat-sink-fan.

I overclocked from 2.80 to 3.66 and it's staying cool and running great.

Definitely worth considering a liquid cooler. They're pretty easy to install if the case has room for it.

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 Post subject: Re: Cases
PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2013 12:01 pm 
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In an age where everything is shrinking it is amazing that more space between hardware actually increases performance.


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