HBO - Game of Thrones SPOILERS INSIDE. you have been warned

[Skelas]

If I ever see another army set up OUTSIDE their walls again i'm going to lose my shit.

[Zouji]

The positioning of the Golden Company was irrelevant with a dragon in play. 

They needed about 100x the amount of ballistas that they had. If they had a ballista and a crew on top of every house in Kings Landing then they could have killed that dragon.

[Skelas]

Yes, Drogon did make positioning irrelevant, It's still stupid though.

[Maren]

I noticed all of the green explosions (Maester's fire or something like that) after Daenarys destroyed them with Drogon..... I am assuming that Cersei was planning on detonating all of those explosives once the combined army came in after the "surrender". If Daenarys didn't start channeling her dad, my guess is that her army could have gotten mauled. Of course, all speculation - but Jon did notice them too and ordered the northerners to fall back.

[Vllad]

I noticed all of the green explosions (Maester's fire or something like that) after Daenarys destroyed them with Drogon..... I am assuming that Cersei was planning on detonating all of those explosives once the combined army came in after the "surrender". If Daenarys didn't start channeling her dad, my guess is that her army could have gotten mauled. Of course, all speculation - but Jon did notice them too and ordered the northerners to fall back.

Good point, maybe the look on Cersei's face was, "oh fuck" so much for my plan on using wild fire to burn the army. 

If Varys had actually gotten away with poisoning her maybe it plays out differently.

[Jakensama]

[Skelas]

What I think bothers me the most is how large Danys army is.  If you would have asked me what the casualty rate was at the battle of Winterfell i'd have said 98-99% with the dothraki all but exterminated.  And yet, here we are with a full army.   I get that watching GOT demands a suspension of disbelief,  but I also need some adherence to the internal logic of the story.  Almost everyone died at Winterfell,  figure out some way for Dany to get more troops besides a reverse Thanos snap.  POOF! Army's back!

[Jakensama]

What I think bothers me the most is how large Danys army is.  If you would have asked me what the casualty rate was at the battle of Winterfell i'd have said 98-99% with the dothraki all but exterminated.  And yet, here we are with a full army.   I get that watching GOT demands a suspension of disbelief,  but I also need some adherence to the internal logic of the story.  Almost everyone died at Winterfell,  figure out some way for Dany to get more troops besides a reverse Thanos snap.  POOF! Army's back!

If comic book pirate Euron has a magical teleporting fleet with cloaking powers and apparently only one heat seeking scorpion bolt, her army can have a mutant healing factor.

[Skelas]

test test

[strife]

The way they did the Hound and Mountain fight and their end was perfect. 

I completely disagree. I was okay with the way it ended, but it would have been way cooler if the Hound wouldn't have stabbed him in the head and him just shake it off like it was almost nothing... and when the Mt. had the Hound up against the wall about to crush in his skull... if Arya would have showed up, shoved her dagger through his head and saved the Hound.  That would have been awesome.  The Hound/Mt fight was actually pretty lame.  The Mt/Oberyn fight was 100 times better than Cleganebowl.  I wanted at least one epic 1v1 fight in this episode and it just didn't happen.

There were so many things they just missed the bar on.  

Episode 5 would have been so much better if Daario and the Second Suns would have showed up the day before and that would have been how the number of troops Dany had remaining were what they were. 

If right as Grey Worm went to throw his spear after the Lannisters threw down their swords, Jon would have stopped him and they fought 1v1.  

If Dany burned half the city and Jon ended up killing her and stopping it, saving at least some of the city.

If the original scorpion that was by the dragon skulls, was uncovered with all of the destruction and used to shoot down Drogon.

Hell, I would have liked if Sansa showed up on the fucking dragon that is in the crypts of Winterfell and killed Dany.  That would have been as believable as the size of the Army they had.  

I'm guessing the way it ends, is they have 2 current day people finish reading the game of thrones book at nighttime and the book closes to end the episode... either that or the show actually being in the Giant Macumber's eye.  It's going to be disappointing I'm guessing.

[Skelas]

I also think if Rhaegal had been killed in the war of kings landing, instead of the episode before, that could have been a great catalyst for Dany burning the whole place down. It's just another piece that I think they could have moved around and I would have been more amicable to swallowing the narrative. I'm still enojoying the show, but for gods sake the breakdowns of show logic are really hurting the product.

[Vllad]

I also think if Rhaegal had been killed in the war of kings landing, instead of the episode before, that could have been a great catalyst for Dany burning the whole place down.  It's just another piece that I think they could have moved around and I would have been more amicable to swallowing the narrative.  I'm still enojoying the show,  but for gods sake the breakdowns of show logic are really hurting the product.

That's a pretty good idea. That would have at least made the fight look more even. This fight like the last one was a route not a fight. I am not sure Danny needed much of an army if you play it out the way they did. 


In the end I have no issue with the story. The battle wasn't the important part.

[Zouji]

The routing of the Lannisters/Golden Company helped to sell the whole blood thirsty Dany/Grey Worm angle. Once the Dothraki were in the city you know what was gonna happen with rape/burning/pillaging etc. Armies don't fight on fair terms. If one army can annihilate another with minimal loses then they will do so. 

That's the main problem I have with fair fights on TV. If the fight is already balanced then you shouldn't be engaging in the first place. Most fights aren't going to be fair. An undead Mountain has every advantage over his brother, except for speed. Thus the fight going the way it did.

[Maren]

What I think bothers me the most is how large Danys army is.  If you would have asked me what the casualty rate was at the battle of Winterfell i'd have said 98-99% with the dothraki all but exterminated.  And yet, here we are with a full army.   I get that watching GOT demands a suspension of disbelief,  but I also need some adherence to the internal logic of the story.  Almost everyone died at Winterfell,  figure out some way for Dany to get more troops besides a reverse Thanos snap.  POOF! Army's back!

Well, in episode 4, they tell you  at the opening of the episode that only 1/2 of the combined forces are dead, not 98-99% - primarily for the exact reason that bothers you. They filmed it one way to make it look cool, then said "ooooops! we need the army for more plot stuff later!"

[Maren]

I also think if Rhaegal had been killed in the war of kings landing, instead of the episode before, that could have been a great catalyst for Dany burning the whole place down.  It's just another piece that I think they could have moved around and I would have been more amicable to swallowing the narrative.  I'm still enojoying the show,  but for gods sake the breakdowns of show logic are really hurting the product.

That's a pretty good idea. That would have at least made the fight look more even. This fight like the last one was a route not a fight. I am not sure Danny needed much of an army if you play it out the way they did. 


In the end I have no issue with the story. The battle wasn't the important part.

I think the point of the episode is to show Dany turning into her father - he thought there were traitors everywhere and became cruel as a result. If they had Rhaegal die during the battle, then you could excuse her actions as grief driven rage instead of "I want Cersei dead and this city is in the way of doing that"

[Vllad]

I think the point of the episode is to show Dany turning into her father - he thought there were traitors everywhere and became cruel as a result. If they had Rhaegal die during the battle, then you could excuse her actions as grief driven rage instead of "I want Cersei dead and this city is in the way of doing that"

You make a good point but once it is done it doesn't matter why. The damage is done. 

The thing about her father that you have to remember is he didn't become that way by accident. It wasn't until the incident at Duskendale that Aerys became mad. 

https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Ae..._Targaryen

He and Dany have a lot in common as far as destiny and grand plans go. They both have very similar stories now that Dany's story is playing out. I feel sorry for people who have only seen the show. It makes a lot less sense to the show than it does if you read all the books including Duncan and the Egg. The whole breaking the wheel/destiny thing is very much the same speeches the Mad King gave so for those who have read everything it is very easy to see Dany as the same crazy woman as her father if things don't break right.

[strife]

I'm sure if I did twitter, people would be going batshit over Jon petting Ghost...

[Zouji]

The only thing I had a question about was John going further North at the end. He was sentenced to be in the Night's Watch. Granted him and Tormund were both wearing the black, so maybe they were escorting the free folk back home?  

Also I see GRRM's hand in teasing everyone along with John and then giving us Bran the Broken as the King.

[strife]

The only thing I had a question about was John going further North at the end. He was sentenced to be in the Night's Watch. Granted him and Tormund were both wearing the black, so maybe they were escorting the free folk back home?  

Also I see GRRM's hand in teasing everyone along with John and then giving us Bran the Broken as the King.

I'm lost on why to even have the nights watch now.  What are they protecting the "south" from?  It made sense before with the white walkers and the wildlings being the enemy.  Now the Wildlings are friendly and even part of the nights watch, and the white walkers are gone.... so what's the point?

[Maren]

I'm lost on why to even have the nights watch now.  What are they protecting the "south" from?  It made sense before with the white walkers and the wildlings being the enemy.  Now the Wildlings are friendly and even part of the nights watch, and the white walkers are gone.... so what's the point?

I think that was a placation to the Unsullied - Taking the Black is a known custom (and they need a place to send criminals), but for Jon, it's really just exile to go North to be King of the Wildlings. Tormund never took the black (and I don't think Wildlings were allowed to anyways), and I don't think Jon would escorting all of the wildlings by himself.

They never really explained what happened to the Dothraki - the Unsullied were going to Naath, but the Dothraki did not seem to be a part of that fleet (although you saw Dothraki walking along the harbor front when Jon was walking to the pier).

I think the part that really frustrated my wife (and partly myself), was the momentum and build up to Dany being "the mad queen" followed by the anti-climactic kiss/dagger to the heart. I was fully expecting Dany to try to execute Jon as a traitor using Drogon in front of everyone, only to have Jon be unscathed by the flames proving his Targaryen blood.

[Zouji]

Tormund was wearing the black when we saw him at the end. Thus he was part of the Night's Watch. I assumed Tormund was Lord Commander of the Night's Watch now. 

You had, probably, a several month time span between Jon killing Dany and the conference of the Lords/VIPs of Westeros. So I'm sure lots of things happened in the background.

[Vllad]

I think the part that really frustrated my wife (and partly myself), was the momentum and build up to Dany being "the mad queen" followed by the anti-climactic kiss/dagger to the heart. I was fully expecting Dany to try to execute Jon as a traitor using Drogon in front of everyone, only to have Jon be unscathed by the flames proving his Targaryen blood.

 Jon got burnt in season 1 so I am pretty sure Drogon would have laid waste to him. I feel the ending was pretty good. The more qualified and the only guy not hated by everyone ended up King which makes a lot of sense based on how the story played out. Jon killed Dany so he couldn't end up being King without another war. Plus I don't have to ask, whatever happened to...

I know what happened to everyone. Pretty satisfying if you ask me.

[Vllad]

Tormund was wearing the black when we saw him at the end. Thus he was part of the Night's Watch. I assumed Tormund was Lord Commander of the Night's Watch now. 

That was Bran sending Jon to a place he knew he wanted to be in the first place. Jon was going North to live among the free folk which is where Jon wanted to be in the first place. Jon has no intention of coming back would be my guess. I doubt those left in the watch would any longer be interested in going to get him.

[strife]

Did Jon want to be with the wildlings? I think he would rather be with his family.. only problem is, his family was going separate ways.

Jon didn't really fit in with the wildlings. It made sense for him to befriend them when they had a common enemy, but Jon is too honorable to really live their lifestyle.


I wasn't a big fan of the last episode mainly because they kind of made a mockery of it with Samwells speech. That made my stomach hurt.

I liked the ending with Danerys... I really wasn't sure if he was going to kill her or not... Not sure why Drogon didn't kill Jon though. It didn't really make sense for them to disarm Jon when he met with Tyrion, but let him bring his weapons to meet with Danerys...

[Skelas]

........